s/pdif recording

Use this forum to post comments or suggestions about the current beta

Moderator: Derek

s/pdif recording

Postby Glenn » Thu Aug 13, 2009 2:25 pm

Hi Derek, another new problem for you: The Mytek arrived yesterday and I was able to hook it up and sync the M-Audio to it without any difficulty, however the new beta won't let me record beyond 16/48 - the other options are greyed out. I was able to do a 24/96 recording using Audacity, de-click and compress the file in WC (16/44 using triangular dither in ssrc_hp) with only one minor difficulty.*

In trying to fix this I deleted the registry settings pertaining to bit depth and sample rate as you suggested in an earlier thread, but it made no difference.

Within WC, the record device is set as M-Audio Delta AP S/PDIF, and the playback device is set as M-Audio Delta AP 1/2, with the path to the volume control being C:\WINDOWS\system32\deltapnl.exe. I can monitor the signal; the meters work; everything looks alright, but no hi-res.

Any idea what's wrong?

Thanks,

Glenn

*After several attempts at configuring the encoder for dithering using the external encoder setup dialogue, the encoder wouldn't dither the file until I used the configure dialogue upon saving the files. Not sure if that's a bug or not as I'm still learning to use that capability in WC, I'm not clear on why the changes don't take effect when using the setup dialogue.
Glenn
 
Posts: 212
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:07 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: s/pdif recording

Postby Derek » Fri Aug 14, 2009 1:38 pm

Hello Glenn

Now why didn't I think of trying that?

You're quite right. The souncard settings are not checked very robustly and that is causing the problem you describe. It's because the souncard is clocked by the external source so the normal settings are rejected. I'll get a fix out for this today or tomorrow.

After several attempts at configuring the encoder for dithering using the external encoder setup dialogue, the encoder wouldn't dither the file until I used the configure dialogue upon saving the files. Not sure if that's a bug or not as I'm still learning to use that capability in WC, I'm not clear on why the changes don't take effect when using the setup dialogue.


The command line you enter in the setup dialogue is the default command line for the encoder in question.

The command line actually used for a conversion is remembered between sessions, so it will be the last command line you used. To use the command line from the setup dialogue, use the 'Restore Defaults' button in the Configure Dialogue.

I hope that makes sense.
Derek Higgins
Wave Corrector Developer
http://www.wavecor.co.uk
Derek
Site Admin
 
Posts: 476
Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2005 7:57 pm
Location: Coleshill, United Kingdom

Postby Glenn » Fri Aug 14, 2009 2:18 pm

The command line actually used for a conversion is remembered between sessions, so it will be the last command line you used. To use the command line from the setup dialogue, use the 'Restore Defaults' button in the Configure Dialogue.

Thanks, Derek. Yes, I see now, but I don't understand why when the default is edited the change does not take immediate effect. My problem was that I had no previous use of the decoder so no history other than the default, which (unknown to me) could only be changed through the config dialogue. It took awhile to figure this out as I had naturally assumed I was entering the usage incorrectly.

Anyway, it works great now. Have a nice weekend :D

Glenn
Glenn
 
Posts: 212
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:07 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Postby Derek » Fri Aug 14, 2009 4:59 pm

Hello Glenn

There's now a new build on the beta page for you to try. This goes a long to curing the S/PDIF problem although there's still some work needed to make it bullet proof.

all the best
Derek Higgins
Wave Corrector Developer
http://www.wavecor.co.uk
Derek
Site Admin
 
Posts: 476
Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2005 7:57 pm
Location: Coleshill, United Kingdom

Postby Glenn » Fri Aug 14, 2009 5:20 pm

Hi Derek,

Just tried it; I now see the option for 96khz but not 24 bits.

Glenn
Glenn
 
Posts: 212
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:07 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Postby Derek » Fri Aug 14, 2009 5:35 pm

Hi Glenn

That's interesting because on my setup the 24-bit option is available. What m-audio card are you using?

When you launch the record window, the program tests each sample rate/bit depth combination in turn to determine the capabilities of the soundcard. If the 24-bit is greyed out, it would suggest that the soundcard is refusing to open a 24-bit interface. I'll need to investigate further.

all the best
Derek Higgins
Wave Corrector Developer
http://www.wavecor.co.uk
Derek
Site Admin
 
Posts: 476
Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2005 7:57 pm
Location: Coleshill, United Kingdom

Postby Glenn » Fri Aug 14, 2009 8:40 pm

Hi Derek,

It's an older Audiophile 2496 I bought in 2001. Specifications indicate "all data paths support 24 bit/96 khz performance, no upgrades necessary", although the mixer doesn't offer any means to set the word length. This is done with the Mytek. The installed driver is a later XP driver from the Midiman website, however it doesn't meet with Microsoft's approval, for some unknown reason.

I don't have any idea of how s/pdif works, but the M-Audio indicates it is 'locked' to the external clock, which is somewhat reassuring. When recording with Audacity I set the word length/sample rate under 'Quality' in the 'Edit > Preferences' menu and go. I can set it to 16 or 32 bits as well but I'm not sure how that would be of any benefit.

Glenn
Glenn
 
Posts: 212
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:07 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Postby Derek » Fri Aug 14, 2009 9:11 pm

Yes, that's the same card I'm using. It might be worth checking the driver again. See:

http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=support&tab=driver

I mention this because the volume control applet you quoted (deltacpl.exe) is different from mine (deltaIICpl.exe) (also on XP SP3)

all the best
Derek Higgins
Wave Corrector Developer
http://www.wavecor.co.uk
Derek
Site Admin
 
Posts: 476
Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2005 7:57 pm
Location: Coleshill, United Kingdom

Postby Glenn » Fri Aug 14, 2009 9:51 pm

Yup, there it is. I don't have SP3, but the documentation mentions improvements for SP2, so it must be compatible. Incidently, the driver installer still failed the MS Logo test.

I'll try a recording now and see how it goes.

Thanks again, Derek.

Glenn
Glenn
 
Posts: 212
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:07 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Postby Glenn » Sat Aug 15, 2009 1:05 pm

Hi Derek,

The recorder works fine now. However, playback through the mixer is another problem. It works, then stops working. I had to abandon one session because I couldn't hear any playback. This is not strictly speaking a WC issue, since Foobar won't playback the files either. Resorting back to the m-audio drivers for sp2 fixes the problem everywhere except for the WC recorder.

Am I going to have to install SP3? I'm not sure if this license supports it.

Regards,

Glenn

Update: Ok, I've identified the problem with Foobar as being nothing more than needing to be reconfigured for playback device. I ran into a similar problem when I completed the 1st recording in WC with the new mixer, and discovered shortly into playback that the record stream had actually come from the output of the m-audio instead of the s/pdif input. In other words, changing the m-audio driver inadvertently reversed playback and record sources as originally set in WC. Similarly, Foobar was set to playback through s/pdif - which is not possible.

There is still an issue with playback in WC, but it appears to be a latency issue, though I really can't say. In moving through a session, auditioning with num3 and then hitting the pagedown key to edit a correction, playback after the correction is entered won't resume unless I hit the escape key 1st. In the past all what was needed was to wait for the stream to end, but now it seems to get jammed, and needs to be cleared before it can be re-initiated.

Also, the 'capabilities function' message crops up routinely during this exercise.

At this point anyway, it seems the new driver is ok with sp2. Sorry if I steered you in the wrong direction; I'm a little overwhelmed with all this at the moment. New OS, new audio source, new beta and new media player (I couldn't use Foobar in win98). Whew! I'll get through this, with your help! :lol:
Glenn
 
Posts: 212
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:07 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Postby Derek » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:05 pm

Hi Glenn

I haven't actually used the M-Audio card for playback so I may have the same problem also. I'll try to do some tests later today and let you know. If the card is being externally clocked, it may prevent you from playing a file with the wrong sample rate. It could be, for example, that a system sound might could cause the card to lock up. A bit unlikely but it might be worth switching back to the internal clock for playback to see what effect it has on the problem.

Ref SP3, yes, I think it would be a good idea to install it.. You can download it free of charge from the Microsoft site.

all the best
Derek Higgins
Wave Corrector Developer
http://www.wavecor.co.uk
Derek
Site Admin
 
Posts: 476
Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2005 7:57 pm
Location: Coleshill, United Kingdom

Postby Glenn » Mon Aug 17, 2009 12:01 am

Hi Derek,

Playback outside of WC, with any file type is not an issue with the M-Audio. It is however, within WC.

I had a strange occurance today whilst recording with the new beta. The recorded file was corrupted by tiny spikes, thousands of them, pointing upwards and down. These spikes were on the written wav, and not from the record, nor were they audible during the recording. The correction widths WC made of these spikes were on a scale from 200 to beyond 500. I didn't know correction widths could go that high.

I encountered this once before in 3.5 with the M-Audio (no s/pdif) when I unplugged a device that used a switch mode power supply while a recording was in progress. From the moment the device was unplugged, the recording became corrupted. Again, it was not audible during the recording - only on the written file.

This time, there is no easy explanation. The only way to fix the problem was to increase the ASIO/WDM buffer size to 512 in the M-Audio control panel. I had hoped this would ease the playback issue in WC but unfortunately it did not.

I don't even know if this incident is related to WC or not, as it has never occured with another recorder. It's occurance is so rare, that fact alone means nothing. Keep in mind the only commonalities with the 2 incidences are WC and the M-Audio - absolutley everything else has changed (except the record player).
Regards,

Glenn
Glenn
 
Posts: 212
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:07 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Postby Derek » Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:03 am

Hi Glenn

Thanks for these latest reports. I'm working on them. :)

I had a similar experience myself a couple of days ago with the M_Audio card producing these tiny spikes. However, it's not done it since - which makes it very difficult to diagnose. I'll let you know if I discover anything.

Regarding the latency/capabilities function problem, I also need to investigate this. I had thought the starting and stopping of playback was very robust but I haven't tested very much with the M-Audio card. I think some of these problems might be because the M-Audio driver does not not always respond correctly to message requests. There is some discussion of this on Internet forums.

I'll keep you posted.
Derek Higgins
Wave Corrector Developer
http://www.wavecor.co.uk
Derek
Site Admin
 
Posts: 476
Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2005 7:57 pm
Location: Coleshill, United Kingdom

Postby Glenn » Tue Aug 25, 2009 8:53 pm

Hi Derek, I've made progress at this end. I reviewed a session last night without the Mytek enabled, ie - the M-Audio was internally sync'd - and WC worked as designed without a hiccup. I first got wind of this when I replaced the s/pdif cable, previously an audio cable, with an RG-6 quad shield and noticed fewer hiccups.

It seems in the future I'll have to keep the delta cpl close at hand to disable/enable the internal clock for recording/editing. More complicated, but the results are worth it.

Cheers,
Glenn
Glenn
 
Posts: 212
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:07 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Postby Derek » Thu Aug 27, 2009 9:20 am

Thanks Glenn

Yes, that sort-of corresponds with what I have found. I think it's a good idea only to use the external sync when recording.

I've been busy on a new update - hence the delay in replying. You can find it on the beta page.

all the best
Derek Higgins
Wave Corrector Developer
http://www.wavecor.co.uk
Derek
Site Admin
 
Posts: 476
Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2005 7:57 pm
Location: Coleshill, United Kingdom


Return to Beta Comments

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron